Behind the Golf Brand Podcast with Paul Liberatore

#66 - Handup Golf Gloves: Troy Stewart (VP of Marketing)

February 22, 2022 Paul Liberatore Season 3 Episode 66
Behind the Golf Brand Podcast with Paul Liberatore
#66 - Handup Golf Gloves: Troy Stewart (VP of Marketing)
Show Notes Transcript

We made it to Episode 66 of the Behind the Golf Brand Podcast.  In this week's episode, I interview my good friend Troy Stewart the Vice President of Marketing for HandUp Gloves.

If you are from the Mountain Biking world you would know HANDUP Gloves. Coming straight out of Chattanooga Tennessee they took over the biking world in HANDUP  Gloves in 2014. What began as bold, minimalist cycling gloves for mtb riders, cyclocross racers, and downhill riders has become much more. They have expanded into four separate glove weights to get you through the seasons, introduced a line of golf gloves in our other favorite pastime, and made apparel affordable for casual wearing, cycling, golfing, or just being active outside.

As a company, they land somewhere between fast and fun. Their gear is used from average joes to pros without compromise. The HANDUP glove definitely has a shock factor straight out of the packaging. The visuals of the glove will be noticed by anyone right away. HANDUP gloves feel great and they are among some of the most durable gloves tested. This durability comes with a firmer feel when comparing them to AAA Cabretta style options but that is expected given the difference in prices.  The HANDUP gloves are a great option for players that want the diverse color set without paying for the most expensive glove models.


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Paul:

What's up guys, Paul from Golfers Authority. Welcome to the behind the g olf b rand podcast episode 65. T his i s the first one of the 2022 year. Super excited to have a real friend of mine. Troy S tewart from hand u p gloves. Troy and I h ave been friends for probably about a year and a half, two years, I would say. And I mean, l et m e t alk a real friend. L ike we talk all t he time. I'm really excited to h ave h im on the show and talk about hand u p hand u p. Originally started as a mountain biking glove company, and then has now moved to the golf space. They're just good people a nd they make cool gloves and you g uys w anna c heck ' em out. So without further ado, Troy, welcome to the show.

Troy:

Appreciate you having me on glad to be here.

Paul:

So fancy Troy, where are you guys located?

Troy:

We're in Chattanooga, Tennessee. So little Southeastern based company, not a big deal.

Paul:

What's the story with hand up ? So like when, like when did it start like an original brand?

Troy:

It started in 2014. We like Paul said we are a cycling , uh , first company. We are not wanting to be that a forever excited to branch out into both golf and ski and snow. But we started in 2014, did start with a cycling glove. The idea was to create something really minimal and , um, make it really fun. So we, we made cycling gloves that were American flags and floral Hawaiian designs and all that kind of stuff. And the , and instead of just making like black red or white or whatever. So we've been doing that since 2014.

Paul:

Yeah, but you're being Elma here. So here's a real story. Cause I know it cause I know Cody, who's the boss.

Troy:

You , you tell a better,

Paul:

So this is what I heard. So , which I think is cool. Like Cody's wife has really cool idea to make golf or uh , mountain biking club because of mountain biking, which I learned from these guys is that is very similar to golf where, you know, you have their big brands and some of the designs are boring. And so they decided to start throwing thing. And Troy didn't you meet 'em at a bike shop. Like weren't working at a bike shop. Yeah,

Troy:

Yeah, yeah. That was just a , a bike shop. College kid going to school for marketing. He gave me my friends .

Paul:

Right . He's like, Hey, I wanna do this. And then you're like, okay, cool. Like he's being super modest. Right? So like, this is what I know. So like hand up was like, nobody start like everybody else, but just in the mountain biking world and they freaking blew up and like their only real big competitors who I know it is it's Fox. Right?

Troy:

Well, that's somewhat true. We have some people that are copying us and all that good stuff, but well copying, not the right word. They're just doing stuff similar.

Paul:

That's like the right. That is the right word . I come

Troy:

On , bro. No, we have people that are our size. Um, but there's like, there's basically four or three big brands. So you've got or four, excuse me, Fox Troy designs. 100% in JRO and we actually a year ago beat out JRO on like a survey of, you know, what the next mountain bike glove would be. I would say we're easily in the top four of all the big options and Fox has been around forever. I mean , even if you don't yeah .

Paul:

They're huge. I mean , that's like massive. That's like, that's like Ford, right? Like there have been around forever.

Troy:

Everyone should have , like , if you don't know what Fox is, like, I promise you've seen this sticker, you know, they've got a history in the do I had

Paul:

A Fox. I had a Fox sticker on my Susie rodeo go back in .

Troy:

Yeah. Just cuz it's Fox . Like you gotta have it. It's you know, it's, it's just synonymous with like being outdoors and being off road , I guess. So yeah. I mean, yeah . Maybe quit being modest. Like we have 30 professional athletes. We I've got a former tour de France writer . We've got a back to back national on hill champion. We've got world cup teams. So it has blown up from like a, you know, spare bedroom, like brand that we got going or Cody and Jamie got going. And I came onto very early to now like a respected part of the cycling industry. But with everything we just have written and bikes for so long and talked bikes for so long, we wanted to do something different. And our entire brand is about just as much about biking as it is drinking , uh , being off the bike and enjoying like a social portion . So , uh, the golf world was perfect because we've, I'll be here in our cards. Let's just be honest,

Paul:

Duh. I mean , you're gonna buy it from the car girl.

Troy:

Right.

Paul:

So that , I mean, this is like , so here's the story here . This is the true story. So true . And I become friends, like, I don't know , it was like two years ago and he's like, Hey, we're coming out this glove and this towel. Yeah . You know , we wanna send to you. And I looked at him , I'm like, oh, it's cool. You have an Arizona one. So I'm like, oh yeah, cool. We become friends. Right . We talk for like an hour or two. And then , um , they send to me , um , then Cody, like , I don't know what that was like probably October, but for mountain biking, probably

Troy:

For a mountain biking event. Right? Yeah .

Paul:

They're doing like a tour cuz they're from like Nevada, right. Aren't something. Yep . And

Troy:

So marina,

Paul:

They were coming down to Phoenix. I think there was some kind of bike event here. And so we had coffee and we hung out at like the coffee shop at my house at the Starbucks and like totally hit it off. Cause like they're just cool people. I didn't understand the parallels between golf and mountain biking. Right. And it's , and even they're completely different sports. They're very similar. Right. Because the price point, you know, the loyalty once you're addict to it , you're addict to it. Like it's one like sure . I didn't. I was like, holy crap. You know, like the price point really blew me away too. Cause that's like cheap to be the mountain biking at all. Like, and I'm not talking about do is the bike. It's like all the other stuff you have to buy.

Troy:

Right. Yeah. And that , that's something we're pretty against, but it's, you know, you can see that reflected in all of our pricing, but yes. I mean that's, there are so many similarities. It's unreal. I mean, when we started getting into golf, I was blown away by, I mean you can go buy a use set of clubs or 1500 bucks or less just something to get the job done.

Paul:

Right. You said , no , bro,

Troy:

What ? Yeah. I mean , I was getting ,

Paul:

You said PhDs or something.

Troy:

What? I got a tailor made burners. So I feel like that is the like Honda accord of golf clubs. Like everyone's had ,

Paul:

Those are really good. Actually.

Troy:

I love them . I think Honda Accords are great cars . So it all makes sense. Judge .

Paul:

The civic ,

Troy:

It

Paul:

Was stick shift when I was in law school .

Troy:

You're the step down bro?

Paul:

I was scared of my , I was scared of death driving that thing. It was so fun to drive. What's

Troy:

The Honda. It

Paul:

Hold the value. Like I never went down price.

Troy:

What ? What's the, what's the nineties Honda civic golf club equivalent.

Paul:

Probably like ping or ping. Uh , I or ping red eye toos . I don't know . What's my dad had like , That's probably about higher . That's probably a Cadillac back then.

Troy:

And then all my, all my new golf buddies are getting tight list clubs and I'm like, that's gotta be like the BMW or the Mercedes. Like

Paul:

I think the PS are

Troy:

Oh really? Mm . Okay . See, I'm learning.

Paul:

I like P you know, like I like walk . I liked them from afar. I'm actually getting fitted on for a set this morning or this afternoon, like to try out right. To see if I like the title list or the P better. I I'm like starting to geek out a little bit on like equipment, like more than normal. Cause I'm like, I'm really starting to understand like all these little like facets of like, why , why things matter? Right. Cause you hear all this talk, but then it's like, I , um, I'm learning about like why weights matter in the head and the shaft and the right grip? Like , yeah, you all hear this, but until you actually it and you see, you're like, oh my God, this game is so much easier than I thought. Right. Like, because you realize you have the wrong equipment, like for real, and it's not all, some of it's hype don't get me wrong. But like some of it's like legitimate, like, oh, that club is too flexible too . The chaps too , you know , uh , as much flex in it or it , the head is not, it's a bad head design. This is why like, I'm like , oh really cool. You know, I don't .

Troy:

But do you think that golf, so this happens in cycling, like, do you think that golf there's a mentality where more money equals better play as far as gear is concerned? Because in the bike world, I mean, when I was at a bike shop to , I used to say something to the effect of like, you can buy speed. That is true, but like half a percentage faster. Right? So marginal it's barely worth it, but it is the case. And sometimes it's a little bit more so how much, I mean, it seems like a world where I could be convinced to buy some big driver thinking it's going to , you know, take me the distance. And if I don't know how to swing it, that's not gonna help me at all. But how many people get sold on that?

Paul:

Everybody. I think all the it , my honest opinion, I think heads are developed every year . There's a lot of marketing hype on that. I'll okay . I'll gonna tell you my story. Here's a true story. Okay. This is my opinion now. So like two, three years ago, I buy a really super high end of Titleless irons. Like I bought all 'em used. Right. But an offer up and they were like still seven $50, like $2,000 set of iron. And like the guy who told me it was hilarious. He's like, oh, I bought these cuz Jordan speed was using 'em and he won with it and I'm a new golfer. And I just realized I suck and it didn't work for me. And I was like, oh man, I'm getting these things for seven 50 bucks. I was all excited, dude. I could even use them if my life depended on it. Right. Like, and so when I started realizing that , like, even though it's super high end and it's like really fancy, I just can't hit it. Like I can't hit blades. That's the first thing I've learned. Like, I'm not that good. Like there's sweet spots. Not big enough for me. And so I think, unless you play a lot and you're good, then yeah. You could, you know , nothing gets blades. Don't get me wrong. I just, I'm not good with them . Now. Some people say, well, you could , if you're , if you're trained with blades, then you can use them and you can be really good at it. All the pros use it. Right. Yeah . But I think it depends on like what your , your skill level is and how much time you really have, because in the end of the day, like you just have the ball , the . Right. So it's like, I mean,

Troy:

It's the same . I mean, it's the exact same thing in the bike world. It's like what the , all these little nuances of a carbon fiber frame or something like that. It's like for the average, Joe, the average weekend warrior, just get the middle of the road stuff and move on with your day. I guess. You know, I don't , I don't know. It's very interesting to me also. I'm sorry. I've gotten this like completely off topic.

Paul:

No, that's fine. So like, here's the thing too. It's like talking to the guys at Deborah about this the other day I was at their office and I was like, you know, people, I felt like people, you can look fanciest set of irons in your bag. Right. Whatever they are or whatever. Right. And people are like, oh man, you got the whatevers. And then you suck. Right . So it's almost like, it doesn't matter how good your stuff is in your bag and how fancy it looks in it. Right . If you go with the ball and you suck, they're gonna be like, why did you , why do you have that? You know, like, yeah . And you're cool for about one second and that's about it. And then everyone realizes that like you don't need those things. And I I'm , I'm coming to a point now where I just want clubs that like are made for me. And that makes me have more fun essentially.

Troy:

Yeah. I mean that's so I got a , I found a putter at a thrift store. That was definitely just one that was like in somebody's office. It was like a for show putter, I guess, cuz it was actually wrapped or covered

Paul:

Brian

Troy:

On it. No, no, no , no. It says like it's like from the Pepsi corporation and it was like covered in gold, like 24 karat gold. And

Paul:

It was not thrift store.

Troy:

Oh I'm serious, dude. It was like, like, like an estate sale or something. But I mean it's like the lightest bit. Right. So it's hilarious looking cuz it's just solid gold . I'll send you a picture of it over the top. Um, but it's fun . It's fun. I like taking it outta the bag. It works. Like I'm not a , I'm not a great putter, but it works just as good as all the other I've had and it's uh, it's just great. I just love having it and that's, I don't know. I'm I , I , that's obviously an another extreme example cause I'm not even sure this putter was like built to be on the course. I'm sure it was just built to sit in an office. But I think like to myself often, what if I got really good with this? Because I could with an amount of time, you know, and then I'm just a rock solid putter with a goal like novelty butter .

Paul:

It's so funny, dude.

Troy:

Yeah. That's that's the goal. That's funny . So anyway.

Paul:

Yeah. I , I just think I agree just too much hype around

Troy:

The gear . Yeah . The gear world is , is weird. So let's, let's talk about gear. Let's talk about hand up gear, I guess. Oh, let's

Paul:

Talk about gloves. The transitions Troy.

Troy:

No, I'm kidding. Well I'm not, but no,

Paul:

No

Troy:

You I'm gonna apply to all this logic to our glove too. So don't worry .

Paul:

So that's a serve hand up . If you need your bike fix Troy fix it.

Troy:

I'll

Paul:

Fix it. So you guys started hand up and you guys obviously blew up in the mountain biking. Like they really did. If you go, this is the best fricking I love this story. So here's our story. We talked about this too, because like, you know , the , they started a second Instagram account, right. For golf. Sure . Didn't you ? And so like a nobody account, right? With like no followers with a couple pictures of gloves. And like he was telling me, then we first started talking. He's like, look, I talked to all these like quote unquote influencers. And they're like, oh, they look at my account and they wanna charge me money and all bull crap. Right. And so like, but little , they know like he's from a bigger company. Right. It's like , but they're so stupid that they didn't even like , go check like, oh, it's the same name. But it says something little different. Like , so

Troy:

Essentially, well I think we have it in , I should know this, but I think we have hand up the main account in the buy , which has like 45,000 followers and it's , and

Paul:

It's full of like cool pictures, like tons of like professional mountain bikers that are like they're they're ambassadors. Like, like , and they like , they don't even pay these people. Right? Like they just like their gloves. They're cool people. Right. So , so it's so funny cuz he is like, yeah, no one wants to review it and no one wants to talk to us and I'm like welcome golf. Like, you know, it's like people, even

Troy:

Other companies, you know, it's the , it's the season of like collaboration in and doing fun stuff. Even local people like, Hey, do you want to get together and play? Just like, just talk. It's not, it doesn't even have to be business related , but nothing. You know? So it's, you know, actually this

Paul:

Is so funny. I mean, it's not funny, but I'm , I guess I'm trying to show like people like what it's really like, you know, like of course we do it differently . And Michael , I said, Hey look, dude, I don't charge for that. Like I just don't. Yeah . So like, and then we became friends. Right. And he , okay, go send this stuff . That's cool. You have an Arizona flag golf club. I'm like, I want that. I wanna try it out . And you , and like that was literally it, I don't the right word is to describe what that's like. But I mean, it happens all the time and

Troy:

Yeah, but I mean it think, like you said, like you like the story. I mean, obviously I'm biased. I like the story, but I think, look, we make a glove. That's good enough to ride like down a out. I mean, if you see these downhill guys, it's hard to walk up the tracks. It it's like riding your bike off a cliff. We make a glove good enough to hang onto your handlebar and do that. So we know gloves and I,

Paul:

You don't like, you are a glove company. It's like, that looks like an Asher or like Palm decided to make a mountain biking glove and they're called it like as mountain biking, people are like, oh, whatever, your mountain bike . Like you don't know .

Troy:

I think they make

Paul:

Company.

Troy:

Right. They, they , I mean, yeah, those, both those companies make wonderful golf gloves, but I just, you know, it's nothing against them. I don't think they could transfer into the mountain biking world. Whereas I think we have paid attention to gloves across a lot of sports and what it takes to,

Paul:

Well , you

Troy:

Don't don't feel good

Paul:

In that liking , like they just keep snowboarding as well. And yeah, like they're , they're , that's so funny cuz you're a glove company, right? Like a successful glove company coming into the golf market. Right. Yeah . Which is saturated, right. I mean you have the totally you have the brands, you know, the , I don't count the big brands. I like the big boys, but like

Troy:

We're never gonna

Paul:

The ashes or the Palm I'm friends with both those brands, like make excellent gloves, good people, great stuff. And then there's all these new brands that are coming in , um, you know, trade secret. Like it's like they all give such different same people, right?

Troy:

Yeah .

Paul:

The manufacturers overseas that make gloves. Um , right.

Troy:

I think those guys, so like Asher and Palm have like done a really, really good job and they're, I certainly respect them, but the , the sort of next tier, which I think we are at right now , um, you know, it's not that I don't respect them. It's just that like, they are not bringing even mildly close to the amount of knowledge that we're bringing to the a table. And certainly not the story. I mean, I think when I see other brands pop up, it's like, we want to disrupt the golf. It's like, that's okay. I mean, we are doing that too, but yeah. How , how

Paul:

Are you

Troy:

Than making like a funny golf glove where there's very

Paul:

Few brands that are really disrupting golf. Let me tell you that. Like if there are I'm I talk to 'em because I'm like, that's cool. Like that's cool. You're disrupting. This is why, this is why I thought you guys were doing something cool. Like even your glove was like super cheap. Right. And I was like, like super cheap, not super cheap, like , but I mean cheaper than a normal glove, you'd buy that 20 plus dollars. Should I put that that way? So I mean like, but then you , but it's like in any other sport , like you come in at a lower price point, people think it's crap. Right? So it's like this weird balance. Like, do I charge what I wanna charge? Cause I think it's a good price for what I'm doing or do I charge some inflated price because everyone else does. And then it makes it so that the market doesn't look like I I'm a piece of crap. Yeah . Right . Like

Troy:

It's , it's a tough call. We , we did that with bikes though. So we were like the comparable bike glove was 35. We came in at 26. Um, now our glove is quality. We've proven that over the last seven years or whatever the hell the math is about almost eight years,

Paul:

What we're trying to do is just like, you can come in Lu as a price point. Yeah . But like mountain biking goes with $35 golf clubs . Aren't right. I mean, you get a nice as glove for 22 bucks , right. 24 bucks , same thing with Palm. Right. And like, and they're nice gloves. But the thing is, is that like, if you come in under that $20 price point, then it's like, it's like golf balls. You come in under $20 price on a golf ball, then people are be like, oh , golf , ball's garbage is $20. Cause the Proby one is 45. And it's like, I mean, like,

Troy:

Right, right. But I think garbage ,

Paul:

It's a weird balance. It's like hard to figure out where that is in any market.

Troy:

Well, and then I think it's, you know, this is probably a little too harsh, but it's almost like a moral obligation not to like price gouge people. And we do that in the cycling industry. We, we don't price gouge people. We charge a very fair price in the cycling industry. So I think we wanna bring that to golf too. You know, like in the current climate that we're in, there's a ton of talk of, you know, being inclusive and stuff like this. Like nothing is more exclusive than gear, you know, costing, you know, having to refinance your home to afford the gear, to participate in a sport. So we are trying not to do stuff like that. You know, for example, in the bike world, you know, a Jersey might be $120 , which is, I mean, I'm sure there's polos that are like that and stuff. There's all sorts of stuff. They probably hit it's that, that there's, you know , interchangeable between the sports. But for us in the bike world, you could get a set of gloves, shorts, a Jersey and socks for $120. So one Jersey or a full, you know, kit to go ride your bike in. So that's what we want to be . We feel like that's actually includes that actually grows the sport work because scary .

Paul:

Yeah . Not , not, it's not being inclusive. You're not, you know, it's like, especially when you look at golf now, like golf has grown so much in the last two years, like massively, right ? That like people you can't keep on charging these exclusive prices that make it harder for people to play this sport. Like when they're , when they're spending $400 for a outta clubs, like at Costco, which is just as good as your said that it costs $3,000 potentially, you know, that person really care . No, they wanna go play golf with their friends. Right, right.

Troy:

Um , and then you gotta go pay to play and stuff like that. I mean that's yeah . You

Paul:

Gotta pay to play . I didn't think about that. You go mountain biking. You're just gonna go mountain bike , like anywhere essentially.

Troy:

So they get you on the front end by charging like six grand for a bike.

Paul:

Yeah. You just have to be in that sport. The parallels between golf and , and mountain biking are like exact, it's just , it was so weird. I heard, I was like, oh my God, this is just like, it just different, but it's the same. What did , what did you guys decide to come into the golf space then?

Troy:

19 ? Well, I mean, it was only, yeah, I think it was 2019 or so, and again, I think I said this at the beginning, like it was totally based on us being interested in golf. It wasn't a business . You

Paul:

Golf guys. You're just like, I , I know cause you guys play golf and muni every Thursday or whatever it was, right?

Troy:

Yeah.

Paul:

Yeah. Like under the summertime, I mean , you hear that men's league or whatever, you guys will just get drunk and play golf. Yeah . Like that's what they did. Right. And they're like, oh, we ship a golf company. Like it's just so cool because the transition is like seamless, right. Like sure.

Troy:

And the manufacturing affordable

Paul:

Golf equip there essentially. Yeah . That's the hard part. Like , but that's thing, it's like the balance. Right. So it's like, we wanna make affordable golf equipment, but we want, don't want people to think it's. Right. And like the mindset. And it's like , how, where is that? And that , I think people come into this thinking, I'm gonna go make a whatever product and charge what everybody else charges right now, which is X dollars. Right. Right. But then it's like, again, you're just playing right back into the same system that's already there.

Troy:

Sure. I mean, look, the, the, a company I really like, I mean, you know, me, you know, I'm a big like fashion guy and stuff outside of that don't really look at much today. Just got a big black sweatshirt on, but a company I really respect is Lulu lemon . They develop all their materials. Like it's, you know, they charge high end price. But if you look at what they've done, as far as the athleisure technology go or not even Aleia like athletic created the technology. Yeah. They made it. And now, you know, they're actually competing with Nike, like the welding of the seams, the way it's all cut, you know, where they put zippers and stuff. Like it's all, you know, really impressive stuff. So that kind of stuff I think is worth it. But when , when in the random, you know, looks , you know, some Tulsa, Oklahoma lady buys a bunch of, you know, sweatpants from China and it's like, well, I'm gonna name it something fancy, get someone to buy, make a logo. And then I'm gonna charge 130 bucks for it too. That blows my mind. Like that's, that's silly. We are not gonna do that. Even though we have a leg to stand on more of a leg to stand on than just saying, ah , we've ordered a bunch of golf gloves here. They are. You know, we have, you know , we developed It

Paul:

Fixing so much money, developing stuff last year that like never made the market . So I'm like those garbage, I would never buy that, you know? Yeah . Like

Troy:

The price to get it right. Is a real barrier. Unless you just wanna put out like random product .

Paul:

Yeah. And if you like , and if you're doing this yourself, you know, like any startup , like it costs your own money. It's not like someone's paying, you know, it's not like you have a bucket of money to spend. Yeah. But I mean , after you see like any of these companies, like, you know, you just grow, you just kind of grow per each round of product you make and go, oh, we're gonna get rid of that. That suck. We're gonna get a new manufacturer.

Troy:

And I mean , you've seen that with us. Our golf glove has completely changed from when we first put it out. It's brand new

Paul:

And you sent me a small one. I was off at you.

Troy:

You're

Paul:

Like, no , like for real, you did, like, you guys sent me, I'm like, I'm gonna do ING for you. It was like a year and a half ago. And he send to me a D, small, like a cadet, small, like it's so small. And I was like this, I was like fat maned , a little coat on my hand. And I was like, you know, I felt like, I felt like OJ Simpson. Right. I was like, Like , if I don't fit, you must have quit. Cause it was that small. And I was like, I'm like , and I was like, oh, like , and then I gotta stop it video . And I was like , I'd to hold it different way. Cause I couldn't put it on my hand.

Troy:

I'm only sending you XL from now on. You're gonna be swimming in it.

Paul:

I got big hands. I think I'm a large, I think I'm a large, cause I think Excel's too big and I don't know , dude, gloves are pain in the. I'm gonna tell you a big pain in the gloves are . Oh, I know.

Troy:

Because

Paul:

Like, first of all, you gotta come with the design. Right? We'll talk about your designs in a second. Yeah , I know by experience. Okay. And I , but like there's a million fricking sizes of gloves. You think there's a million sizes of clothes. Try gloves. Right? How many sizes are there? Extra small, small, medium. Well ,

Troy:

I mean there's double, extra small and then there's X XL . Yeah . Then Y all your standards and then plus the

Paul:

Cadets cadets or even cadet size . I was like, what the hell is the cadet size? So like , oh, in between sides , I'm like, oh my God, you gotta be kidding me.

Troy:

Let's talk about that real quick. Because that's really an interesting thing to me. Cadet sizing is so weird because I mean, we have sold as you know, I mean, there's probably a million hand up gloves out there or , or maybe just shy maybe a little more, but there are a lot of hand up mountain bike and gloves out there. We don't make cadet mountain bike gloves. You know what I mean? Like we don't, we've sold gloves to so many people for so long and I've, I've never, this is like the only sport. It seems that there's like this weird X to size . So we are , we have no intention of making it as far as I know

Paul:

Now.

Troy:

No

Paul:

Freaking way , dude. Yeah . Some , I made those gloves last year and some goes , oh, do you have cadet sizes? And I was like, no, just fricking deal with it. Like, oh, it's off by like a half inch . You're not spend that much money anyways. Like why would I have a whole nother bunch of sizes that cause Cody helped ? Am I doing my first round of glove? So Cody told me like , okay, I'm like, what SI I'm like, what sizing should I do? Like percentage wise . Right. When you buy an order and he's like, I do this. So I did that. Right. But here's the thing like, and it worked. He's brilliant. But the thing is though, like nobody buys smalls and nobody buys extra larges . I'm telling you right now. Like that's what I had left essentially. So it's like, you know, and I don't know . It's just funny because everyone buys medium or large. I mean, nobody buys extra large, like nobody like frills. Yeah . And thousand of 'em . Well ,

Troy:

Cause it's gonna stretch a little bit. I mean, you can get it. I mean, you probably can't stretch a small to a large, like when , in the case of the bad sending glove,

Paul:

You gave a child glove , dude, what are you talking about?

Troy:

I don't, you know, but all I'm saying is we've sold a lot of gloves and we've never needed a cadet size and I'm not convinced that that's a thing that anyone needs. And there's, it just kind of loops right back into the, the that we're sold in , in any industry. And look, I could be totally wrong. We could be making cadet sizes in a year, but right now it doesn't make any sense to me currently. And that's why we don't have them, you know, for folks listening, I guess. Yeah.

Paul:

I think, I think you should do that for people.

Troy:

We'll see. No ,

Paul:

Like for real , I really think you should, You should have a lot . I call the Paul line and then ,

Troy:

And they're all just an inch shorter.

Paul:

Like you,

Troy:

Whatever

Paul:

I've known Troy for a while . I could talk craft Troy.

Troy:

Yeah . So we were , you were saying you wanted to talk , uh , hear about the designs. Yeah.

Paul:

The transition to that.

Troy:

Oh , oh my God.

Paul:

They make cool designs. Cuz like I , when show, cause here's the thing when they first sent me the designs, like the , the first run. Right. Cause that was your first run of gloves. And it was like, holy crap. Like these are cool as hell because like the printing was really good. I think you, at the time you'd done like Arizona, Tennessee

Troy:

Some yeah . We did three state flags. So we did Tennessee, Texas and Arizona.

Paul:

Yeah. And then

Troy:

We did like , and then we did like ,

Paul:

Or

Troy:

Something

Paul:

Or you built on one. I remember something like that. Right. Tell me like, so what's happening now? Cause like, you know, essentially there , you guys were quiet for like six months, like redeveloping love. And because you're like, oh yeah, this is, we can do this. This is cool. That was like a test . Really? Wasn't it like that first round to see like,

Troy:

Well, I mean it yeah, 50 50 . So like we were, we were putting something out that we thought was good, ready for it to be, you know, we want , we wanted it to be, we , we thought it was good. It worked for us. We had some feedback that was like fairly negative , but it was just kind of like, there was always like another variable involved. So someone would say like I blew through my hand up golf glove that I've been testing, but for what it's worth, I'm using like, you know, two year old grips or something, you know, it's it's this happens at the bike world too. People will be like, I ripped up my glove and I'm like, well, did you reckon it? You know? Yeah. Oh yeah. I did. Oh

Paul:

Too . It's so annoying dude.

Troy:

Yeah. So stuff like that. It's

Paul:

Like , cause you got the wrong size. Like that a factor. No , like for real, it's like I putting it on. I ripped it. I'm like, was it the right size in the beginning?

Troy:

How hard are you pulling this on? That's the issue . But

Paul:

You like , I mean , seriously, you ripped it. Like, like seriously. I'm like, you're still pull of . Like dude, I know like I know you did. You used it. You it's too small. I mean,

Troy:

Come on. Oh yeah. Come on .

Paul:

Like I'm like , all right , I'll send you a new one. Here you go.

Troy:

Right. Exactly. It must be . I didn't get enough coffee in this morning. What , where would we go ? I keep losing my train of thought.

Paul:

This

Troy:

Is

Paul:

Talking about Tennessee.

Troy:

I know you start losing it. He cause

Paul:

He on vacation tomorrow. It's all you .

Troy:

I , I was just about to say that I'm about to leave for you New York tomorrow. And I'm just like not phoning it in with you per se . Well , cause

Paul:

We BSing for like an hour before we have the show.

Troy:

Um , no . Um , talking about, so

Paul:

You guys had these designs

Troy:

Market old love on

Paul:

The , let me ask this question. So then on the initial run of the initial, like how many designs you have ? Like probably seven or eight I think.

Troy:

Yeah. I think we had seven or eight and those, those, oh yeah. I remember what we were talking about. Like

Paul:

How big was that run though? Like how many did you make? Like a hundred, 500. A thousand of each

Troy:

One? No, no. I mean probably a, maybe 1500 or so . I mean , we were , we were like , this is our , this is our golf line . Yeah. This is our golf line to get started. You know,

Paul:

You sell

Troy:

Out pretty close. Yeah.

Paul:

Random, like small and actual larger , like everybody else left over . Yeah.

Troy:

But it wasn't the feedback we got started to be, it started to be like, there was a percentage of negative feedback that we got that we weren't like happy with. Um , what, well, people just going through it quickly. Um, you know, like , yeah . That's just , just kind of standard issue stuff, stuff that I think was probably not on us, but just not worth it because look, we're comparing it to the bike world where we have relatively no negative feedback. So we're like, well we need to get there with a golf glove . Like we need a good standard. So we went back and redesigned it and, and we went with a full Cabretta leather Palm this time instead of like a synthetic it's still synthetic on the top. What's the

Paul:

Topate of,

Troy:

It's still like a PE synthetic blend

Paul:

Because you can't print on, I don't know , lie about gloves last year, so right . So like , first of all, you can't print on Cabrea leather. You can't, I can't see that . Never , never been able to.

Troy:

I mum it about half the time myself.

Paul:

Like what , why call something else? Like the good

Troy:

Yeah. Call it something else. Yeah.

Paul:

But like you can't print on it, which I didn't know that. And it's called Lyrica , Lyrica . What's it called? The

Troy:

Title

Paul:

Liker . See, I don't know . I kind of terms, but you can print on that. It's such a it's fake leather, right? That you can put on fake leather, but you can't fill in real , like Cabrea leather. It's not fake leather. It's just not Cabrea leather.

Troy:

Well it's well, it's not like it's, it's not like animal leather, right? Like it's like a synthetic leather. But the cool thing about that is it , it feels really snappy and flexy. So I think it takes the comfort through the roof. You don't have to wait for the glove to stretch to, you know, really feel comfortable playing around in it. It's pretty much good to go when you put it on. So it's, it's absolutely my preference. So we do a lot of that here. Like if it's we know gloves, we, we are thinking about that . You know , we're hyper focused on the things that people like. And don't like, for example, I think

Paul:

What I learned about gloves last I'll tell what I was about . I , I mean, I did a limited run of gloves. I wanted to test the , I just wanted to see what I learned is people like black people, like white , um , people like designs. They really do people. Don't people do not like colors. That's what I've learned. Like, like people don't like G4 color, crap, which, you know, they'll buy if it's cheap enough. But look, I , and I didn't know that. So like, you know , you kind of test these things to see what people actually like, you know? Cause you ,

Troy:

And you look at G4 and you think they know what's going on. Their gloves are, That , man. Yeah. There's so expensive.

Paul:

They're $40 for a glove. And it's like, that's not my audience. That's not who I am. Right, right . I would never spend that much money on a fricking golf glove. Um , nothing comes at G4, you know, I thought, oh, all these cool colors, like people are gonna want that. No man. People don't want that. People want designs. What you guys are doing. They don't black and white.

Troy:

Yep . That's what they like

Paul:

Aware . They like black and they were like white. Right . You would be that's it.

Troy:

And I think that's something too. That's kind of like interesting. I , I wonder we all have inspiration with the hobbies that we participate in. So sometimes I do wonder do people like white golf gloves because everyone they've seen before them is worn a white golf club . It's like part of the uniform. Right? So there's a part of humanity that says, I like the consistency. I'm not breaking any molds here. I just look like a golf . I want to go golf. I wanna look like a golfer. And I want that. Therefore I want like a nice clean white golf glove. And honestly that mentality fed into our new line because a lot of it is , um, a white based background with different designs on it. So we have sort of like a beachy design center .

Paul:

You can see the design. Right, right.

Troy:

It's we have a tacos and margs one, it literally just has like stencil art of tacos and margaritas and stuff. So there's all this flavor. That's us. That's cool. Yeah. From 50 away you look like a normal golfer and look, we are us we're there will be another hot pink floral, you know, we'll do stuff like that, but it's just gonna be a minute. I think. So

Paul:

What are the thing like when I say colors though, I'm saying like yellow, right? Or

Troy:

Like a right solid colors. Yeah .

Paul:

Like those, you know, a FIA , like one , you look what Asher's done with like the Browns, like it's beautiful. Right. It looks really cool. Yep . I just think that's what I've learned, you know? And I don't know ,

Troy:

It takes a special

Paul:

Person , a minority in my opinion, but I mean, I saw it right. Like I saw what sold out. So here's the thing that's happening in golf though. Right now. Like what's happened over the last three years now . I really feel like bad birdie, like started the trend. Sure . Is that like design right. Design and golf. Like, you know , everyone's making polos now that have patterns. Like no one was doing that for three or four years ago, but like now I like it. You know, everything's everything's pattern now. Uh , people wanna stand out on the course with what they're wearing with what they have on their bag, what assessor reason they have with their bag in their bag, whatever. I love it, you know? Like

Troy:

It's

Paul:

Fun to be unique, you know ? Yeah . And I think want people want to be, and I think now that golf is not being is , be , is not so exclusive. Right. Cause it's changed so much. Like honestly, dude, there is no sec , like the market for secondary clubs is like, non-existent you cannot find used clubs like anywhere, like really the price you can. They're like through the roof though. And I've talked to like big companies that do this, like for a job. Yeah . Yeah . And they're like, yeah, we can't find 'em anywhere. Which I think is cool because really, I think there's so many new players. If you can get a use set of clubs, you know, for 500 bucks or less, or, or, or get a , a tech , the technology. Yeah. It's all . It's cool. And it might help you heal a little bit further or whatever it is. Like honestly dude like clubs from two, three years ago are just as good. You know, if you're new .

Troy:

Yeah . No, I believe

Paul:

You. I just think it's cool cause of how you guys are stepping into the space and what you did last year is like the pattern cuz no ones really doing patterns on glove . I mean sure . Palm has the pattern like in the fingers and on the wrist they've been , that's like their signature look. Right? Sure. But I'm saying like

Troy:

Great looking glove too. Yeah.

Paul:

Yeah. And they're cool as hell. I mean , those guys were these two and a half years. Um , yeah . Their storys really cool too. They started on um , what's that thing Indigogo but whatever it's called called . Oh cool.

Troy:

I don't not know that. Yeah. I mean, but what , yeah. Like we are bringing like the full pattern to the, to the table, you know, where I think that sets us apart a little bit. I think our story sets us apart a little bit, but honestly, man, I I'm glad you brought up bad birdie that's I meant to say that in the beginning, just for like sort of ease of explanation, but we are the bad birdie of like the cycle. So we're trying to move that , um, excitement over to, you know, the golf world and, and the way that we experience it, you know, a big part of hand up too is like the community experience, the, you know, putting on events that we've done for years and going to events and you know, you know, showing up and having a beer with people and making the game fun. Right. Growing the game as everyone likes to say, so that's gonna be something we bring to the table too , as golf continues to grow, like I hope we're traveling out to see you and we're going to a golf tournament or a golf expo, not just like a bike event where hitting golf on the way. I think that's, that's what hand up brings at the table outside of what I, I think is a really rock solid golf glove now.

Paul:

No , I think what you guys are doing is cool. Like, are you guys still gonna do those towels? Like you did that first time.

Troy:

Yeah. We'll continue doing towels. It's all we , we, as a company, love to have like matching accessories and stuff. So, you know, we have socks that often match the gloves or if we don't do a , we do a Jersey to match the glove. So if you're like, if you want, if you like the boldness of the glove, you can have a little bit extra. And I think golf towel, our golf towel is the perfect, you know, match up there. But what I haven't sent you, I don't , I don't think this will ever match, but cuz it would be kind of weird. But you know, we make apparel in our pants that we designed for , for mountain biking to be sturdy and flexible enough to mountain bike. Really just look like a standard pair of, you know, ath , leisures slacks kind of thing . So I think there's a ton of transfer there to get into some pants. And I need to send you some because I think you love 'em and they are like $69 retail. I think every comparable pant is over a hundred dollars out there from big brands that everyone would know on down to like smaller brands that are doing stuff like we are doing. So maybe that's another item

Paul:

Are all these gloves that are on the site right now, are these, all the new ones that are coming out? Are there the , and more

Troy:

That's all the new ones that are coming out. I think at least as far as the spring is concerned as we start to sell through

Paul:

11 glove right

Troy:

Now . Yeah. So that's a full new, like 20, 22 lineup just like mountain biking. So we come out with like a spring lineup and then pepper in bunch of collaborative launches and one-off designs that we want to bring to market. Maybe an athlete has a signature glove or something. So as golf grows, we'll apply the same concepts and we'll do a bunch of really fun stuff. You know, I'm just kind of waiting on someone really fun to work with to come along and then make like a collaborative glove or, or whatever ever . So yeah .

Paul:

Who does the designs?

Troy:

We brainstorm them together and then Cody will typically put it together. We do have an in-house designer. Now his name is sta so he's helping me with I'm. Our marketing director probably should have said that in the beginning. So I've like sort of in a marketing assistant that splits time between helping me out and then doing design. So two designers on staff essentially, but Cody, I think did a lot of these, this lineup of designs. I'm sure we'll see what works and keep having fun and even do things that we know won't work, but we want 'em , you know, that's kind of the fun of the, the smaller, more mobile, you know, brand. We don't have to make 20,000 units to, you know, sell to golf galaxy and every shop in America, we could still do some fun stuff right now. So that might change one day. So

Paul:

What other products would you guys want or are, are you guys gonna stay in the gloves and towels area? I mean, right now you have one towel on this site. Are you guys gonna make more towels this year

Troy:

Or are you gonna , we're gonna make more towels this year. So I think those are coming or being worked on, but so we got gloves and towels. We've got the pants that I think are totally doable. I don't know how far we're going to stretch into the golf world. There's like a huge over saturation with polos. So in the , in the early stages of this, we were really, we met cricket golf and those guys were awesome and we've had some communication with bad birdie and they're , they're wonderful folks as well. So I just don't know if there's a ton of interest there, but it's kind of a never, you never know scenario, but I tell you, what I would like to do is I would like to, for golf to continue on this sort of loud mouth know, breaking the mold trajectory to the point where we are making like golf, basketball jerseys to be worn out on the course or you know, something like why , like I wanna bring that kind of stuff to the market, not the same thing that everyone is doing. So of course golf will have to continue to change and be disrupted, I guess, as a, as a sport altogether.

Paul:

No, I think it's cool. What you guys have done. I mean, I mean, really you guys came into the golf space less than two years ago. Right ? Right. And this is kind of like not your main gig,

Troy:

You know? Oh. Not even close,

Paul:

Like this is like one person 1%. Right, right . What you guys are doing and just coming into a new market and like, that's why I think it's cool that one, you guys did it. And then two, it's like, you know, if anybody's gonna be successful at what you're doing, it'd be you guys just because you had the experience and you've done it for so long that like, you know, it's not hard. It's not hard for anybody to start a quote unquote brand right now, because essentially all you have to do is build a Shopify store and then go buy stuff from China. Right . I mean that's but like to be a real brand,

Troy:

That's , that's two main steps. Yeah,

Paul:

Yeah, yeah. You know, but, and you see that a lot now in the golf world where there's a lot of , um, lot of up and brands and you're like, dude, that that's,

Troy:

That's nothing,

Paul:

I believe that same exact image on Alibaba before, you know, like, it's like you cancel sell crap, essentially don't sell crap.

Troy:

Well, and then there's, there's not like a brand to be a part of. There's not a story there. It's just bunch of like, you know, a bunch of guys being, you know, interested in making their own thing. And yeah. I mean, there's not really much there, whereas there's, that's again, why I respect the ashes and the Palm coast of the world, because there's OB , there was obviously like a real vision story , um , there and a real story.

Paul:

Well, that's the thing too. Like I've walked into brands , offices before, like these small midsize brands. Like I , when you walk into a brand, a real brand, right? Like if I looked to your device's place, I'd be like, holy crap. Because it's one thing where you use bicep online and build a website. It's a whole other thing where like, you're actually developing a product. Sure . You're coming up with concepts, you know, you're rolling the diocese, you think, you know, it's part of your overall story. Like, you know, you, you'll never be able to compete with people like that. I'm just telling you right now, like people out there in the world, because unless you wanna build your own company, essentially. Yeah.

Troy:

Um ,

Paul:

But it's, what's new for you guys then this year in golf, just those gloves. Um ,

Troy:

Yeah. I mean , I ,

Paul:

I mean, they're on the site now, but like is at the spring dry, I would say

Troy:

It is. We , we try to have stuff on the site as early possible. So those are like up for folks that are still out, you know, braving the colder weather, but there's a plan to like spring launch . What you talking about? It's a

Paul:

Of the year .

Troy:

We're not, not so lucky. That's gonna be the that's the spring launch, but we are gonna sort of put it out more publicly. I guess this is , this podcast is probably the first up and putting that out there more publicly. I think the big focus of this year is there's two, two things. So sort of growing a customer base, right? So brand awareness, letting people know that we exist, why we exist and that we have a product that, you know, they can be a part of , um ,

Paul:

You guys market to your mountain bikers. I bet you lots non like

Troy:

It's golf

Paul:

Or it's like, you don't wanna mix oil and water.

Troy:

No . I mean, it is kind of an oil and water. I don't, as much as they are similar, there's not a ton of crossover, but we do market because everyone has like a golfer in their life. Right. Just like everyone has like the weird uncle that puts on a bunch of spandex and rides road bikes every Saturday morning. So there's like that kind of crossover. I think our cycling audience knows we have it. I mean, it's on the site a hundred percent of the time, but it's not something I push to the cycling audience. I have an actual, our I'm building an actual golf audience for us to work with. And you've been a big part of that. So it's been fun to like sort of reach your folks and just kind of let 'em know we're here. But the other big goal for the year is the more community based thing . So there's a really cool league called LA flare golf. That's up in not Ville Tennessee. And they reached out to us and wanted to work together on ju simple prizes. And I got to look at 'em and they have all these like hilarious traditions. They got a good crowd coming out to golf with them and it's all, you know, they just cover in their cost . It's super fun. You know, it's just not stuffy. That's all it is. And so I'm working with them right now to see, you know, how we can be involved in their community. Like how can we help them throw a tournament? Can we surpri prizes or whatever? And now there's a caveat there. They're actually making it fun and cool. They're not just like giving the close the pin guy, pair of gloves and moving on, like they're, we're setting up a 10 and you know, we have our, we actually have our first hand up golf tournament that we're attending is not actually a hand up golf tournament. It's their tournament. But the first tournament we're attending as a sponsor and a , you know, a vendor there on March 12th. So that's kind of the goal too, is to like get out and shake hands and crack beers with people and have some for freaking fun, you know? And well, that's

Paul:

What a lot of these, I mean, that's what a lot of people are doing and like at least out here or not, you know , on the west coast, I guess like, yeah . You know, Melbourne has his league or his group, the guys here in endeavor and Arizona have their group it's

Troy:

Like there's one in Arizona and Scottsdale. That's like CPG , or I'm trying to think. There's a guy I work with out there too. That's this like basically sponsored by bad birdie . And then this LA flair group is a partner with bad birdie as well. I , I thought you might know who I was talking about. I cannot remember the name of it's to say my

Paul:

Life. Well , I mean, Deborah has their valley golf club golf, something.

Troy:

That's, that's not it. I I'd have to look it's, I'm gonna be on my fun for a second and figure it out . It's

Paul:

It's so much freaking fun, dude. It's just so fun. Like I think as golfers, as we get older and we have families, like you just wanna go hang out and have fun with people, right? That's all you really wanna do. That's what golf's all about. And I don't know. I think having structured events where you don't have to put your own force , somebody together and like figure all that out. Like you just go and have fun. Like that's what we want, right. Like ,

Troy:

Right. Well, and this is crew

Paul:

Essentially. Like, I don't know . It's you wanna hang out with cool people?

Troy:

Sure. I mean, that brings it full circle. That's like, that's exactly what's happened in the cycling world. And that's why we've been successful is we have promoted that aspect of the cycling world as much as possible, the community orientation, the, you know, this year I've been like when you see a bike rider on the trail and you've got hand of gloves on and you see someone else and they hand up gloves on like, there's like this nod, like people are fist bumping. Like I've had our professional athletes tell me this. And that doesn't happen with like the bike. They're riding the tires. They're riding like helmets and there's, there's sort of a fun there . There's kind of like a wink wink. You're you're out here to have a good time. Huh? When you get out, hand up gloves on and that's what we're going for, right. Is it's not a tech feature. It's not, I'm not on this podcast saying our gloves are the best gloves ever made. They're they're good, but they're not gonna change your game. You're not gonna swing better. It's just a good glove. That's, that's a nod to your personality, a nod to taking things less seriously and having a lot more fun doing it. Um, and that's what we're after. You know, I don't, I don't know if we'll ever be someone that sponsors someone on the tour unless like there's a John daily kind of character that that's the kind of stuff we're after. And I know we're not the only ones doing that, but for the other reasons that we've talked about, like the expertise we brought to the table, that's what I think sets us apart in this space, by the way, it was the , it's the casual golfers association, CGA tour out of Scottsdale.

Paul:

I'll look into that. Let me yeah .

Troy:

Check

Paul:

Them out. I'm a casual golfer.

Troy:

Yeah. We all are.

Paul:

I mean like seriously people think of thing . So seriously, like so serious that like, they don't be honest. We're not that great. You know, like, yeah. To me, like I went to a event with Deborah back in November and it was like the funnest. I I've done two of them and there's so much freaking fun. And it was just like hanging with cool people. And yeah, I played like crap that day, but it was at a nice course. We had fun, you know, just a good , good time. And that's really what you want. And I think like outside of a quote , unquote , a tournament, right? Yeah . Or, you know, as you get older, it's harder to find people to go play with, like, you might have one or two friends that play, but like, it's just different now, as you have kids, you're younger than me, but like, you know , men's league or something, but like, that's why we do it. We wanna go hang out and have fun. Like you , it was four hours to rest

Troy:

And I want to do it. I wanna do it without paying $75 to do it. I want to do it without being like condescend when I walk into a clubhouse because bro, that's part of it too. You know, the old guard that is like legitimately, just, you know, that make it so difficult. And this is saw that

Paul:

With the waste management open, like media about all this stuff happened , like, hell yeah. I'm glad that happened. Like of course I'm why not. Right. And then

Troy:

That's a very stereotypical person. Oh yeah . Doesn't it doesn't like that. And

Paul:

The other side, the old guard, it's like, oh no, that was bad for the game. Really? So what's good for the game that we , we discontinue doing it . We've been doing it for a thousand fricking years. Yeah.

Troy:

Like we all tuck in our shirts. We put air pastel colors, we play pay 200 bucks to play around and we get mad the entire time we're out there. That sounds like such a way to go about this sport. So we are like a ,

Paul:

I'm glad that happened on the biggest stage. Hell yeah . I'm glad. I think , think it's just funny. Like I'm gonna tell you, like it was , we did a poll on, on Instagram on Monday, like, Hey, what you guys think about the waste management open ? You know , we'd love to hear what you think about what happened. Right. Whatever. And so like, everybody was like, oh yeah, you know, it's about time. It's great. Whatever. And then what happens is like, if you post em on Instagram, usually post on Facebook, right? Like if you have it all connected, dude, I had the complete opposite response on Facebook. I was like, oh no , that was bad. Blah, blah,

Troy:

Blah . Yeah . I

Paul:

Was like, oh my God. Look

Troy:

At the demographic of Facebook , media all . Yeah. It's I know

Paul:

It was so funny cuz you just see it. And I was like, wow . Yeah . Like

Troy:

We , the same stuff happens to us. It's like we do something funny on Instagram and we've been posting, we've doing TikTok media and posting it to reels on Instagram. And it's like blowing the Facebook demographic out of the water. They like, don't get it. They barely know how to watch it. And it's just like , it's fine. Maybe that media just doesn't need to end up on Facebook look . But yeah. The responses that you get, like jokes that land on Instagram do not land on Facebook almost ever. So it's, it's , it's just part of it. I think

Paul:

We're changing. I'm telling you everything's changing.

Troy:

Yeah. So we, we want to be it's listen. The exciting part of this for us is that totally lucked into this, right? Like we chose to go after a sport that we wanted to be a part of at a time where the way we would want to play it, be a part of it is changing is moving that way. So as soon as, you know, sooner , the better that things can continue to go that way, like am praying for the day that I don't have to wear like khakis and a heavy polo to go play. And I can just walk out.

Paul:

I swear to God, this happened like literally like a year ago we were doing a , a , a video shoot at a Cho that my friends works at like a G there. So like , oh , you cousin gonna do a video shoot . So we did. And I come wearing like workout shorts and a T and I'm like, I don't give a like whatever. Right . You know ? And the guy I was filming with, who's a pro who knows wearing like the typical Garp and my friend goes, you can't wear this here. And I was like, you're joking. Right? He's like, no man, like for reals. And I'm like, you're joking. Right, dude, I spent $200 in that pro shop that day on clothes that were, I would never wear in a million. I'd wear it by a pair of pants. I wear ugly Adidas, like polo shirt. I would never F and wear. And like I was miserable.

Troy:

I was like, dude, this is the , it

Paul:

Still exists.

Troy:

This

Paul:

Is , it blew my mind. I was like, this you're being serious about this. Like he's like, no for reals. I was like, you're not even a private club. I'm like semi private . I'm like, that's. I'm like, anybody can see there as semi-private club. This means that they have people paying dues. They can play more than other people like . Right .

Troy:

Yeah . Truth . That's nothing actually different. No dude. That's that's exactly. So road bike , it

Paul:

Blew my mind. I was wearing like workout pants and like, yeah. You know, whatever

Troy:

You can right now you can go. If you're a fan of road biking and you like the tour de France, you can go buy the same bike. They ride in the tour de France, you can buy at least look the part. You can buy all the glasses and helmets and ride all the stuff and talk about it the same way. And it grows. People's egos through the, like the fact that you can look. And I said , I say , I've said this for years. It's like, I'm a huge Georgia football fan. Like I can't put on pads into Georgia football Jersey and run out on the foot on Saturday. Therefore I'm just a fan, but I can put on like the heirs of a pro cyclist and convince people and convince myself and golf is the same way you can go buy all this . And then you can be like, well, I look the part and I know what to ,

Paul:

Yeah . I know I've seen it. I've seen it. Like I've , I've even seen it while playing with other guys, like at events, like they'll have like a full like G4 outfit essentially. Right ?

Troy:

Yeah .

Paul:

And I'm just like, and I like , they look the a hundred percent look the part and they're in good shape. And like , I'm like, oh my hair should be good. No, these suck. Like , yeah . And it's like , dude, everybody else like stop dressing up. Like you , you're better than you really are. Cause at the end of the day, we all suck. Unless you're playing every day or you're on the tour, then you don't suck better than that. Like that's why I love what happened. The waste management opened because yeah . I was like, I love those guys. It's

Troy:

It's relatable. It's fun. It's what we all want.

Paul:

What do you think the whole waste manager was even about? They're still like , you don't think it was gonna happen. You're giving alcohol like crazy. Like my , I didn't go. Cause I was cause of other reasons this year, but like, I'll go next year. But my friend went and he goes, they were in a tent for work, dude. You know the drink pass was like the drink pass. It was a 10 drink, 10 maximum 10 drinks you got for free . Like in the , in the, the thing he goes, I was, was after the third one. And like they're giving you 10 drinks. Like you don't think people are gonna have fun and go on now, dude . Like that thing is the biggest fricking party. Like it's so much fun. But then you see the old guard, like, like at least on media wise , like , oh, that was disrespectful of the game. Oh, shut up. Whatever dude, grandma . That's like ,

Troy:

Okay ,

Paul:

Okay Cameron. Yeah . Think , you know. Well , cause they have to tow the line. Right. And be like, oh, that's bad. Because our readership who buys our magazine would not like that. We have to say that dude , whatever shut up.

Troy:

Yeah . And for what it's worth, I meant to say this too, cuz I feel like I harp on people that sort of fit this mold. But if you wanna rock a whole G four outfit, that's awesome. Go for it. I don't, I don't mind that. What I mind is the attitude that you feel entitled to once you do that, that's the thing that hurts the game. You know, I've had experiences. I , I mean, I remember when I first started riding and you would show up with guys like this and it made me not wanna ride a bike anymore or go on group rides. I was like,

Paul:

It reminds you when you're like in junior high and everyone's supposed to . Totally. And like the kids that were cool in elementary school, all of a sudden become a Dick. And like they're the rich kids or they have the nice clothes whatever's popular and you're just like, you feel like like, well , you know, I gotta have that same stuff. It's the same, same thing, dude.

Troy:

So

Paul:

If you , and it's not even about how good you are.

Troy:

No. So if you, if you actually want to grow this sport, if you actually want to right. You need to be okay with gym shorts and t-shirts on the course not wearing the right shoes. Maybe

Paul:

Not having range. Yeah. Fricking right . Dude , you dress up when you go chipping and putting . Yeah. Right. So why do you dress up and play a part when you're on the course with three other dudes you don't even know, right ? Yeah . Seriously.

Troy:

And look, the , the experience I have with this, it was somewhat off putting , which is fine. Like if they got rules, it's fine. But this is my story. Right. I go to the driving rage. It's like 110 degrees in this summary here. A hundred percent humidity. I've got on a tank top. It's not like ratty . It's not got holes. And it's just a tank top. And the guy at the clubhouse is like, well, you know, I might let you hit today out on the driving range. But like, don't wear that again. I kid you not. I walk out the door, the guy teeing off on the first whole looks like the dude, the main character in that tiger king show on Netflix. Like he looks like a crazy person, bleach blonde , mullet jeans. Like I'm like where I look normal. I just look like a , other than the sleeveless shirt. I look like a regular dude.

Paul:

But imagine if you're a new

Troy:

Player and you got like a crackhead on the first

Paul:

And you do Scott, your use clubs or your set at Costco or whatever, right . Or hand me downs, you go to a course and then they're like telling you, oh, you're not dressed the par . So you can't play.

Troy:

I'd be done. I'd be done right there.

Paul:

Like seriously you that guy's never gonna come back because HES brand new doesn't know anything. But you know, it's like dumb. I yeah .

Troy:

So not continue, you know, beating a dead horse here. The point of hand up is to sort of push forward the, I , the other idea, the opposite of this stuffy traditional and, and again, I know we're not the only ones doing that. That's not really the point here. We're sort of like joining the fight I guess, and, and actually growing the sport. Right . Or actually trying to, and get people in a good set of gloves while we do it. You know, we did the same thing with mountain biking, the whole goal with , with cycling , um , and mountain biking in particular was to get people to realize how much fun it actually was and relax a little bit. And it's hard to be and afford yeah . And afford. But it's hard, you know, we've got a pink and purple and neon, Hawaiian print mountain by glove. It's hard to be like, I'm a badass in that. Like it's just fun. It's just, it says party time on the palms. You know, we do

Paul:

Alls happen . I think in the last three years in golf is that like, it's changing, it's

Troy:

Changing. Like , so we want to be a part of that change. That's the goal.

Paul:

Well, I'm glad you were on the show today. Like I said before, they're good dudes at hand up , you guys need to check out their gloves and other stuff too. I just take gloves because it's for golf. But um ,

Troy:

I appreciate that. You

Paul:

Know, it's cool to see like a brand end . That's trying to change the game, coming from a place and experience that they know how to do that and to do it right. So I appreciate you being on the show today and being my friend, my real, my real good friends. I have lots to talk about , Troy . I'm not gonna tell 'em on the show. Um , but they're all good. And you guys need check out, hand up gloves, what your guys, you are else . They can just Google

Troy:

It. So it's just hand up gloves.com. So, and it's H a N D U P a lot of people you hear it and then they remember it differently, like hands up or whatever. It's just hand up , hand up gloves dot coms, right ? So hand up gloves.com. And there's a golf section. You can Peru and, you know, take a look at the mountain bike section if you want, look at it all.

Paul:

Great. Well, thanks for being on the show and I will see you. I will talk to you soon again. Yeah. And I will see the rest of you even sooner than that. So thanks Paul. Take care .

Troy:

Appreciate it. You too.

Speaker 3:

Thanks for listening to another episode of behind the go golf brand podcast, you're gonna beat me a golf stay connected on and off the show by visiting golfers authority.com. Don't forget to like subscribe and leave a comment. Golf is always more fun when you win, stay out of the beach and see you on the green.